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| Author: | Window4U (IL) |
| In Reply To: | SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by E-Z) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 06:27:12 |
I too saw this when it came out in Window & Door Magazine.
I don't think anyone really knows how this system will perform in the real world over the long term, but it has an interesting and promising concept. I certainly have an open mind, and welcome any advances in window technology, but I have a sneaky feeling this will be one of those innovations skewed towards helping the manufacturers make more money by cutting costs, and not specifically made to help consumers have the best window. The fact that dessicant is still needed in this system makes me wonder about it's longevity and gas retention properties.
I guess only time will tell what the downsides are to this system, if there are any.
| Author: | E-Z |
| Subject: | SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 06:01:01 |
I would like to get the opinion from the regulars on this board regarding "Sashlite" is it the future of windows? or is all this money that big corporations are investing in researching this technology a waste. Check it out and then post your opinions cc:fenex,window4u,guy, and all the experts in this board.
I think that while it is promising, a big drawback for window manufacturers will be the cost of replacing the sash of an already installed window.
Looking forward to all your postings.
| Author: | FenEx |
| In Reply To: | SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by E-Z) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 13:37:10 |
I have also seen the article in DWM. I always applaud new technologies and will be watching this product evolve. First of all, I love that site animation... how cool is that. My initial concerns with the product is the concept of direct glazing due to the vastly different contraction and expansion rates of glass and PVC. With a separately sealed I.G., they can each do their own thing and the only concern is a little air infiltration if the glass to sash seal fails. In this case, if it failed, you lose everything. In addition, I didn't see an option for the possibilty of triple pane glass.
Next concern (for me) might be the sealant itself:
"SashSeal(TM) Sealant is a patent-pending system from H.B. Fuller utilizing a hot melt moisture-curing product." "Over time, ambient moisture migrates into the sealant bond line to chemically cure to the vinyl and the glass".
Maybe I am reading it wrong, but isn't that saying their sealant itself is permiable by moisture and if so how could it possibly retain the much smaller molecules of a gas fill? How long is "over time" and how much gas will be left by the time it gets ready to cure?
I will be following the product over time to see how it performs. Thanks for the post EZ... good stuff.
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by Window4U (IL)) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 14:25:47 |
I think it's interesting. My big concern is in the field. Changing out the glass in the field may pose a big problem. In oreder to change out any inactive panel you will need a couple more tools. Unless I miised something about panel removal? I guess your right! Time will tell.
| Author: | Dan |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by Guy) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 14:55:21 |
Currently the sashlite technology is for casement windows and double hung windows. The vinyl extruders are working on designs so that the non-moving lites in single hungs and picture windows would have removeable portions that would essentially be a type of mini sash.
The sashlite system can save money for the window manufacturer as making the insulated glass would be on the same line as the sashes with fewer steps and less cost. But they will also be providing an insulated glass system with the warmest edge of glass temperatures and posibly one of the longest lasting insulated glass units available.
The biggest problem I could see with the sashlite system would be in getting a piece of glass replace. The adhesive is bonded to the glass and sash which would require total sash replacement. You would have to trust that the sash could be replaced in 10 or 15 years if it got broken. I do not know of any vinyl window manufacturer who is making the same window today that was being made 15 years ago.
| Author: | Oberon |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by Dan) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 15:12:16 |
I also agree that this is so new that I have no specific opinion of it so far.
I am curious about glass handling processes when combining the sash and the glass as one unit and not a separate IG unit.
Using a moisture cure adhesive isn't at all uncommon, several of the Dow and GE (and even Novaguard) products that are commonly used for glazing are moisture cure, but those sealants are used primarily to glaze the IG into the sash, and are not used to actually seal the IG...and hot-melts are strating to show up in a number of window manufacturers inventories, but I am very curious to see what the long term effects of using a moisture cure sealant, to actually seal the IG, with no desicant will be...
| Author: | E-Z |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by Oberon) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 16:18:23 |
I agree Fenex that's a killer website i wish i had that kind of money.It makes me start my own window manufacturing plant.Except that with all the potential issues raised here it would have to be "Hardy windows" instead of "E-z Windows". About the technology i can see a small to lower medium size company jumping all over it and being succesfull with it. Big companies are still on the sidelines regarding spacers upgrades, let alone a complete overhaul like the sashlite technology, that's why i think this is good stuff for an up and coming small company and that's what makes it very interesting. I also see the potential for it to just not take off at all. All the points above by everybody are valid and i would bet they have experts like yourselves working on solutions or a good rap to argue them.
E-Z
| Author: | Dan |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by E-Z) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 23:15:43 |
The technology is actually better suited for medium to large window manufacturers. The equipment for applying the sealant to the sashes is rather costly. The larger window companies are looking for any way to reduce cost in a window. As far as manufacturing an insulated glass unit the Sashlite system is the least expensive. Most larger window manufacturers are already using intercept because it saves them a ton of money compared to swiggle, aluminum spacer or Super Spacer.
| Author: | Dan |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by Oberon) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-29 23:16:56 |
There is a desicant matrix that is applied in the channel seperating the glass panels.
| Author: | Oberon |
| In Reply To: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by Dan) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-31 22:17:08 |
Thanks Dan. I read thru the description pretty fast and must have missed that.
It should be an interesting experiment.
| Author: | Windowtech |
| In Reply To: | SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY (posted by E-Z) |
| Subject: | RE: SASHLITE TECHNOLOGY |
| Posted At: | 2004-09-01 05:39:54 |
Not many window manufacturers can even benefit from the technology, but some may find that it reduces their cost, depending upon the way their manufacturing facility is arranged and/or their product mix. But as far as the consumer goes, it is unproven in the field, and it obsoletes their window in the event of a "sash failure" if that particular window design is dropped or the manufacturer goes out of business.