St. Louis Options?

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stlm
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St. Louis Options?

#1 Post by stlm »

Does anyone know of any St. Louis area installers that are reputable?

I have a ~85-90 year old brick house with what are probably the original wood windows and aluminum storm windows. The wood windows of course are drafty and don't really open or stay open as the window weights/pulleys are broken.

I've gotten a few quotes so far for replacing 5 windows:
-Pella's Encompass: 3,000
-Pella's 350 line: 4,350

-Champion: ~3,800 (quote is 2-3 years old though as I have no desire to listen to another high pressure sales pitch for an mediocre window/company for the updated quote).

-Contractor using Viewpoint 3000's with low E/argon ordered thru Noradex (he may be able to order other windows thru Noradex as well but his usual window is the Viewpoint 3000) = He figured a ballpark figure around 1,600-1,700.

I haven't found too much out about the Viewpoint 3000 yet other than it's made by Atrium. I haven't been able to find the specs on the window yet. Although some forums seem to say it's an acceptable mid-ranged window, but not the best.

From what I gather on the various window forums, Pella's vinyl are considered overpriced for what they are. From what I gather people here recommend Okna, Sunrise and Soft-lite?

I don't think Okna is available in Missouri. I'll probably set up times to get a quote from a couple Soft-lite dealers. Seems there are 2 in the area. One sells Elements; the other sells Imperial LS. (They both may have Barrington and Bainbridge. Soft-lite's website suggests they do, but their own websites don't mention carrying them at all).

I don't necessarily need the top of the line windows, I just don't want something poorly constructed, so I'm open to hearing any middle of the road ideas as well. For what it's worth , I'm unsure how long I will be living in the current location as well.

Thanks for any help/suggestions.

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TheWindowNerd
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#2 Post by TheWindowNerd »

the Soft-lite LS is a great window.

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Windows on Washington
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#3 Post by Windows on Washington »

Of the windows you have looked at so far, the Pella 350 is the best of the bunch. Still a pocket sill so I cannot give it a ringing endorsement.

Of the windows that you haven't seen but have contacted them on, the Soft-Lite Elements is a very good window and I would also contact Okna to see if they have representation in your area.

In addition to the Soft-Lite and Okna, a Sunrise Restorations would be a great option as would a Home Guard Innovations.

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HomeSealed
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#4 Post by HomeSealed »

+1 on the recommendations above. I personally would not recommend any of the options that you've seen so far.

stlm
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#5 Post by stlm »

Thanks for the help so far. I've got an appointment set up with a soft-lite dealer to see what the cost would be. I've tried contacting Sunrise to see if they have a local referral. They said they'd give my info to a regional guy who would know more and would get in touch with me. Days later no response yet, even after I sent a follow up email. I called Okna as well and they don't sell in Missouri.

The Home Guard Innovations? Is that only a Indiana product or is it available elsewhere? I'm having a hard time figuring out who/where to contact to find out if it's available here.

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Windows on Washington
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#6 Post by Windows on Washington »

Contact Home Guard. It is not an Indiana product only and should be available near you.

It is their flagship window and a very well designed product.

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HomeSealed
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#7 Post by HomeSealed »

HomeGuard is available in many markets, but not yet in St Louis. Very nice window and excellent entry doors.

stlm
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#8 Post by stlm »

I called HomeGuard last Friday and found out what Homesealed has confirmed here that their product is not available in my area.

I met with the 2 dealers of Soft-lite:

The one that sells Elements gave a quote of $3400 and they are running a promotion this month of a free upgrade to the Ultra S triple Pane glass. The installers will stuff fiberglass in any empty pockets in the wall. I asked about the price of the Bainbridge and he said that they are really only 30-50 dollars cheaper per window and it would be in dual pane glass, but he never gave me a formal quote on them. Turn around time to install is about 6 weeks.

The other installer sells Imperial LS and Barrington. He said around here no one really needs triple pane glass it's more important further north. For 5 Imperial windows with dual pane the price would be $4200. For Barrington's it would be $3600. Their installers use low expansion foam and the sales guy wanted me to know they used expensive long lasting caulk, and turn around time is 7-9 weeks.

Later this week I'm going to meet with a guy that used to run a small window factory in this state but sold it/closed it years ago because of the competition from large companies. He's now a wholesaler of windows so I'll see what kind of deal I could get from him and what windows he sells.

I thought I read that the Elements and the Imperial LS are pretty similar. Is there any reason to justify $800 price difference (without factoring in double vs triple pane)? And is there a preference between fiberglass or low expansion foam installation?

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TheWindowNerd
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#9 Post by TheWindowNerd »

The LS is normally cheaper than the Elements.
Low expansion foam is superior, but not a deal breaker, if the windows are caulked well on interior and exterior.

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Windows on Washington
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#10 Post by Windows on Washington »

That is an other worldly deal on an Elements.

Talk to them about using spray foam to seal the gaps vs. Fiberglass.

You can use Fiberglass if they are filling weight boxes because the foam can make a mess.

win1
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#11 Post by win1 »

The statement that "triple pane is not necessary in the this area" is simply not true. Look at the U value differences and condensation resistance rating differences between the Ultra S triple pane and the Dual pane. The truth is in the numbers. The Elements also comes standard with Super Spacer which would be an upgrade on the LS which comes standard with intercept spacer. Both great windows.

stlm
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#12 Post by stlm »

win1 wrote:The statement that "triple pane is not necessary in the this area" is simply not true.
I agree. When he said that I figured he must know the other company selling Soft-Lite windows here had the triple pane upgrade promotion going on. I believe both were at a local home improvement expo this month so I'm sure they were aware of each other.

I wasn't too impressed with his sales attempt. He showed up, took measurements, and then said I'll email you a quote later tonight broken down by room as requested. A couple days later I finally got the quote, with the final price, no break down by window size/room. (I have 4 of the same size window). I was surprised by his lack of really selling the window. If all he was going to do was take measurements, I could have just done that over the phone and saved us both a lot of time.

I got a quote from another place that sells Alliance Belmont windows. The price would be ~2000, with dual pane glass. (Low E, argon, Duralite spacer). I can't find any air infiltration numbers on it though. I haven't really found much on the window. Some reviews say it's a decent mid-grade window, others say it's nothing but a builders grade window.

Thursday I'll get a quote from Sunrise and from there I'll probably have to just make a decision. So far the Sunrise customer service has left a lot to be desired. It took multiple calls/emails to find out local sellers. Then calling several of the installers, it has taken a few days and several calls to get even get an appointment. I'm still waiting for a call back from one of the installers, who was supposed to be contacting me in "the next couple of days." Not too sure why it takes several days to find out when a sales guy has available time to stop by.

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HomeSealed
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#13 Post by HomeSealed »

I'd give a slight benefit of the doubt on the turnaround time for proposals, etc. Fall is generally the busiest time of the year for window installation. If you get the feeling that he/she doesn't want or value your business, that is another story.
On product, if the reviews range from average/mid range at best to builder grade at the bottom, that is not a good sign.
That Elements option sounds like a no-brainer to me. Top performer, aggressive pricing.

stlm
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#14 Post by stlm »

I was leaning towards the Elements as it seemed like a good price for 5 windows and its performance.

I got a quote from a Sunrise dealer. Essentials: ~$2200. While the Vanguard is just under ~3000 with VG Plus glass. He generally said the cost to upgrade the glass was something like 17% the base cost of the window for the next level of glass and then 5% more for triple pane. But then he said it would be like 20 bucks to go to triple pane. I was a little confused on that. In any event he was of the belief in an old house with uninsulated walls, it generally isn't worth the extra expense for the upgrade.

From the paperwork I have it doesn't look like this dealer has a labor/workmanship warranty where as the Element's dealer has a 5 year warranty. I could be wrong on that though and it would have to be a follow up question of mine if Vanguard was the route I took.

One thing that was interesting was that he said one of the windows would need to be tempered as it is near the stairs. Something that none of the others have said or quoted.

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TheWindowNerd
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Re: St. Louis Options?

#15 Post by TheWindowNerd »

The building code requires safety glazing in certain location. Stairs and landings are one of those locations.

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