Foam filled vinyl window frames

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witmyer55
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:18 pm

Foam filled vinyl window frames

#1 Post by witmyer55 » Sat Oct 15, 2005 8:25 pm

Is there anyway to tell if there is polystyrene foam insulation in my window frames- besides cutting a peice off my vinyl frame and actually looking inside???
Ultrasound? Xray?
Please help

handyman19619
Posts: 32
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:53 pm

#2 Post by handyman19619 » Sun Oct 16, 2005 5:01 am

Remove an installation screw and see if that exposes anything . It may or may not.
You could also remove the same screw if it does not already have a 3/8"
hole drilled in it you could do it yourself have a look replace the screw and put a plug over it (you can get these vinyl plugs at hardware stores)
Not sure what this will do to your warranty. It will not harm the window but you are tampering with the product.
Why do you ask anyway? Just curious.
Another way but this will not give you visual satisfaction. Ask to see the original factory invoice or related document pertaining to your order.

witmyer55
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:18 pm

thx for your response Handyman

#3 Post by witmyer55 » Sun Oct 16, 2005 2:39 pm

The windows were labeled by the manufacturer as foam filled sashes and frames as was the contract
I am feel somewhat sure that the frames were not foam filled
I just want a way to determine if in fact they have no insulation in the frames without having to deface the frame in any way
Please help

handyman19619
Posts: 32
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:53 pm

#4 Post by handyman19619 » Sun Oct 16, 2005 7:50 pm

The manufacturer would have nothing to gain by lying to you.
But if you insist follow the instructions on my first post.
Let me clarify when you drill the 3/8" hole only go through the first skin of the vinyl not all the way through the window frame. You should be able to find what you are looking for.
You wouldnt be the forst customer that wanted proof something was there that they couldnt see (foam, argon gas)
Where do you live and what brand of windows did you purchase?

witmyer55
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:18 pm

#5 Post by witmyer55 » Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:40 pm

Would if the manufacturer did not realize they were not foam filled
The plant either thought no one would find out,or they were too busy
trying to place their dealer orders and did not fill the frames
Although labeling my order as foam filled and the dealers invoice as foam filled-But the manufacturer's quality control department never caught the potential problem
Plesse help
I do not want to ruin my windows to satisy my soul

Window4U (IL)
Posts: 1548
Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 8:46 am
Location: Sales and Installation in Chicagoland and Central Illinois

#6 Post by Window4U (IL) » Sun Oct 16, 2005 9:28 pm

As foam filled frames are basically a marketing tool to "set a window apart from others", and doesn't mean squat to speak of on performance, my advice is to not lose sleep one way or the other.
After all, the best performing window on the entire NFRC does not have foam. Nor does the second best, or the third best,......

witmyer55
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:18 pm

#7 Post by witmyer55 » Sun Oct 16, 2005 9:58 pm

If you bought a house full of windows and you contracted and paid for the insulated frames but there was No foam filled frames
You would be ok with that and just forget about it...
Because I was pitched insulated frames paid for foam filled frames and the manufacture labeled the order as foam filled and mine might be hollow
Just forget about it because it does not matter?
Perplexed???

Window4U (IL)
Posts: 1548
Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 8:46 am
Location: Sales and Installation in Chicagoland and Central Illinois

#8 Post by Window4U (IL) » Mon Oct 17, 2005 12:30 am

You bought foam filled.
Your contractor ordered foam filled.
Your contractor's invoice says foam filled.
Your window labels say foam filled.

If you still think someone is out to screw you after all that proof, then your only option as I see it is to take a chainsaw and sacrifice one of your windows. Drilling alone might not work because not all the chambers are normally filled.


(I'm just kidding if no one realizes it)
Last edited by Window4U (IL) on Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

obtuse10
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:56 am

#9 Post by obtuse10 » Mon Oct 17, 2005 9:00 am

:(
witmeyer, i understand your concern. if you can remove the inside stop of your window trim you will be able to see the frame and drill a small hole. the inside stop is the most narrow piece of trim that runs horizontally and vertically around the window and is what the interior of the frame of the new window abutts against. then all you have to do is replace the trim and maybe a little touch up to the stop.

Guy
Posts: 537
Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:41 pm
Location: Minnesota

#10 Post by Guy » Mon Oct 17, 2005 1:59 pm

It's much easier to check the sash. If you remove the sash and yank the "sash lock" or the "night latch" you'll be able to see right in. No sense in drilling a hole. Just use a tiny screw driver on the night latch. The sash locks usually slide one way or the other.

obtuse10
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:56 am

#11 Post by obtuse10 » Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:51 pm

:twisted:
i'm pretty sure he was asking about foam in the FRAMES.....
well, since things are so slow around here....you haven't been dropped on your head lately have you?

Guy
Posts: 537
Joined: Thu Oct 07, 2004 12:41 pm
Location: Minnesota

#12 Post by Guy » Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:09 pm

Well Obtuse I'll just step back. I'm going to just stay away from the witless comments. Your demonic remarks are a sign of your own personal problems. The customers remarks were:

"The windows were labeled by the manufacturer as foam filled sashes and frames as was the contract"

So if the sash is filled more than likely the frame will also be filled. Heaven forbid anyone doing something easy!

handyman19619
Posts: 32
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:53 pm

#13 Post by handyman19619 » Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:21 pm

Obtuse that was mean!! He made a good point. The sashes were to be filled also ,I never thought about it but he is right remove a tilt latch or sash pin and have a look.
I still say drill a hole where a scew was you should see something too.
I do agree a manufactuer has no reason to cheat an order what do they have to gain "nothing"
Are you sure you arent from Missouri "Show Me" state
The reason I asked you earlier what brand of windows you bought and where is I know several factory Reps that would be glad to come out and prove or disprove your worries. Call your installers factory rep and arrange a meeting . Most are very helpful and accessable(thats their job)
Obtuse on a personal note quit picking fights you wont finish because you are bored. Be helpful or leave it alone.

obtuse10
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2005 9:56 am

#14 Post by obtuse10 » Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:29 pm

:(
handyman, please read his post on oct. 16 in the Why different costs for windows everywhere. maybe then you won't feel that way

witmyer55
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:18 pm

again thx all-after checking my options

#15 Post by witmyer55 » Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:45 am

I drilled 3/8 in 4 sides
Found no insulation in the frames/
Contract said foam filled
Manufacturer labeled the windows foam filled
guess i have just been taken advantage of... :x
thx for you help

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