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| Author: | Barbara |
| Subject: | single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-22 20:08:45 |
I've been researching 12 replacement vinyl windows for 6 months and have narrowed it down to 2 finalists -
Amerimax DH - $5,000
Milgard SH - $4,400
Any advice is welcome, especially re SH vs DH
| Author: | installer |
| In Reply To: | single- vs double-hung (posted by Barbara) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 00:54:58 |
What was wrong with Milgard's double hung? A great window with it's top lock.
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | single- vs double-hung (posted by Barbara) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 01:36:58 |
Hey Barb, Here's the scoop on DH vs Sh. The Dh window was mainly made for houses with out AC. Our early days brought a hot house on the farm. The theory being you could draw down the top sash a couple inches and lift the bottom one up a couple inches. This way the room would circulate better. The fresh cool night air blowing in the bottom while moving the hot air out above. This was long before AC came into the picture. So as you see they had functionality. I always ask a customer pondering this issue one question. When was the last time you used the upper sash. almost all the time it's "Never". So if you don't use the top sash it's a waste. Only one downfall exists. You can't tilt the sash in to wash. This may be a deciding factor for you. The SH is more economical and solid. BY having a fixed unit on top it relly makes the frame more structurally sound. One less moving part to deal with. It's your choice. I myself like Amerimax. Others like Milgard. It's your money not ours!! Hope this helped!!
Guy
| Author: | mike |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Guy) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 07:46:03 |
Any chance you know much about the Pella line of Viking windows they call ThermaStar ?
| Author: | curious dealer |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Guy) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 16:05:15 |
Why do companies like Schuco and Champion only sell double hungs and treat single hungs as bottom of the line windows?
| Author: | Barbara |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Guy) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 17:21:09 |
Guy - Thank you - this helps immensely. That's the first clear explanation I've heard!
| Author: | JAIME |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Guy) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 18:29:26 |
Guy,
That was a good explanation you provided regarding the benefits of double hung and single hung windows. I myself chose the single hung windows. You seem to know what you are talking about windows. I am having 34 windows installed in my house. I need some advice as to whether to leave the frames in or have them taken out. I live in southern california and the existing frames are aliminum with a stucco exterior. The frames look good but I am concerned that if they put the new windows on top of the frames they will not be as secured as if they removed the old frames. Any advice you or anyone else can provide is greatly appreciated.
| Author: | Barbara |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by installer) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-23 23:47:35 |
There is absolutely nothing wrong with it that I know of, but I never saw it. The installer that wants to put in the Milgard's was adamant that double-hung's are a waste of money ("noone ever opens them") and , I'm too insecure and pathologically shy to argue with an "expert".
On the other hand, the Amerimax dealer was definitely in favor of double-hungs (for ventilation) although, he would reluctantly install single-hungs if I insisted.
| Author: | FenEx |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by curious dealer) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 01:02:00 |
To begin with... Champion is not near the caliber of Schuco products. As per the post, I will support Guy's previous post to an extent but only in times long gone. Single-Hungs are simply less expensive for builders. Think about it... half the operational hardware... fewer things that can fail. Cost is the only advantage a single hung has over a double hung.
| Author: | Oberon |
| In Reply To: | single- vs double-hung (posted by Barbara) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 02:05:48 |
Here's a little aside to help cloud the issue.
To date, no one has certified to the Dade County Impact/Cycle requirement with a double hung window.
But several companies have done so with single hungs...
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by FenEx) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 06:26:18 |
Good Point FenX. For some stupid reason I forgot that one. I guess the past couple days have beaten me down. I'm gonna have a cookie. Want one?
Thanks for picking me up on that one!!
| Author: | Jeff W. |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Barbara) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 13:08:08 |
Ask your expert to get you the Milgard installation video that shows aluminum frames removed and the Milgards installed. They will look nicer on the interior. Also, single hungs were designed so that framers on new construction could put in a unit half way square, the lower cost is an added benefit. The double hungs are much easier to clean from the inside.
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by mike) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 13:20:20 |
If I'm not mistaken that's the line of vinyl they have. If it is then I personally haven't seen it. I think it's sold by Lowe and MN first store doesn't open until November. I'm sure I'll see plenty of it then. I do install the other line of Pella wiindows. I find no problem with them. I'm sure FenX must have some input on them if he knows. Good Luck!!
Guy
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Jeff W.) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 14:50:31 |
Framers couldn't put a window in square if it was quarter inch diamond plate! They don't care enough. Thats most of the problem. Also you can't use a five pound framing hammer to put it in. Waffle Marks all over the frame.
On another note with no disrespect to Jeff W. If you've never attempted any kind of frame removal leave it to the Pro's. I don't care what video is on the market it's something A Newbie doesn't play with. This requires tools and skills in an area not even a lot of Pro's care to play in. So please have someone who has done it before do this installation.
| Author: | FenEx |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by Guy) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-24 15:52:09 |
I was a Master Carpenter and a General Contractor for many years... there is truth to Guy's comments. Some of the guys can do it all... some are great at one end and lost on the other. I'd hire 20 yr framers that could have a room addition under roof in 2 days... but they'de take twice as long installing 8 windows and trim and allow 1/4" of slop in a 4' level. On the other end, I'd have trim carpenters that could do an immaculate job on a custom kitchen... but ask them to frame a closet and it takes a week as they are sanding the studs!!!
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by JAIME) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-25 01:45:25 |
Jaime, I would always do a total replacement if optional. Make sure you don't get goofy old Jethro from the station down the road to do the tear out. Problems will arise for sure!! Make sure your installers are educted with the tear out and they will repair any damage if it happens. You will gain a bit more viewing area also. Also keep in mind that a good installer will make sure the window is secure and solid. My son sells it by telling the customer it's Guy Proof. I'm a big boy around 290. So if I hang on it or give it a shake. It better not move!!!!! Hope this helps!!!
Guy
| Author: | Guy |
| In Reply To: | RE: single- vs double-hung (posted by curious dealer) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-25 01:48:56 |
They feel it's a cheap imitation! Which I disagree with. FenX says structurally they are the same. He also stated they are even in energy loss. So I respect his opinion and will strongly look at the options.
Guy
| Author: | Window4U (IL) |
| In Reply To: | single- vs double-hung (posted by Barbara) |
| Subject: | RE: single- vs double-hung |
| Posted At: | 2004-08-26 02:50:17 |
Most single hungs are the bottom of the barrel in a window companies line.
They are the cheapest to make, and are targeted at the low end market.
I bid a fair amount of commercial work including a lot of apartment complexes. Singlehungs are ideal for apartments complexes because of their lower price and also there is one less sash for tenants to screw around with and break.
There are some single hung windows out there that do not deserve to be labeled low-end though.
In my search for windows for some of these jobs, I've run into a couple of single hungs that are as good as the companys best double hung. Certainteed and Gorell are two of these, and I'm sure there are more.
Certainteed's single hung is the same basic window as the Bryn Mahr II. A great feature with this singlehung is that you can actually take the top sash out if you need to service it.
The Gorell 5000 series single hung is a very beefy and strong window too. It's very similar to the 5300 series double hung, and it has the ability to be stacked vertically to several stories.
I'm sure there are other companies that also have excellent single hungs, but be dilligent in comparing them to the better windows in the particular company's line to see where they stack up.