Replacing windows - Now lost

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Tadcrazio
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Replacing windows - Now lost

#1 Post by Tadcrazio » Thu Apr 02, 2020 9:50 pm

Would appreciate greatly any input at all anyone here has. I was impressed at the information i saw coming in here and questions and answers provided and hope i can get some light shed on my situation.

I have a fairly small house less than 1800 square feet just north of Atlanta Georgia. The house was built in 1979 and has original windows. I am looking to replace the windows and called around to all the local guys I saw via thumbtack and google reviews, I had 4 different people where 3 of them essentially sold the same window, the fourth guy is making me reconsider what I do.

First guy was selling the Alside Mezzo window installed at a super low cost and he seemed to take pride in his work. His price just can't be beat and he seemed to speak highly of his installs and capping. He told me his offer on the price expires on Sunday.

Second guy sold interstate 6800 window which was very similar to the mezzo and he advised that capping my windows would be a bad idea since the wood is in really great condition there is no reason to cap which could get moisture back there but if if i insisted he would cap at the same price he quoted more for. He told me it's a cash discount and the offer expires tomorrow.

Third guy was window world, he didn't really beat around the bush said his window is essentially the mezzo but what i get with them is the name and he price matched.

Now the 4th guy, he came in i told him I've been through so many others and really just wanted the details. He told me up front that his cost would be more but it's because he isn't selling mid-grade products and poor work. He was selling the Sunrise Restoration and went on about the windows, how the argon won't leak like the competitors and is filled more, the built in brick-mold, the reinforced frames (or whatever i forget :) ) and how there is no chalk fill so it will never fade or flake. Says they have the best warranty in the industry and they stand by it. He told me horror stories about window world, argon gas leaking, warranties not being honored, etc etc..
Needless to say i don't think i need to tell you folks about these windows.

So now i am at this point where i thought i was going to go with guy 1, good work, cheap price, and what i thought at the time was a good window. However, the 4th guy comes along and drops all this window knowledge on me and i'm not quite sure what to do.

Is the reinforced vinyl and everything else so much better in the restoration windows that i should choose that? I just bought this house, I don't intend on moving in the near future and I want to do what is right but it does hurt that the cost installed of these windows is more than 2 times the others.


p.s, i have 3/4 acre land and directly behind me is a shopping plaza, when trucks are back there i hear their engines, horns, and OH BOY DO I HEAR THE DUMPSTER BEING EMPTIED. This is really only and issue in the bedroom since it happens so early int he morning. Is it worth getting these soundproof windows or whatever that cost $150 more?


Edit: I found this postviewtopic.php?t=1430 which really brought me here to ask about the argon leakage etc. This and the bowing of the sashes spoke to me the most but I'll be damned if I get flaky windows in 5 years as well.

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Windows on Washington
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#2 Post by Windows on Washington » Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:46 am

Throw out number 2 and 3 in my opinion.

After that, the guy pitching the restorations is correct in that the mezzo is not nearly as good a window. If you like the guy in the 1st quote, that make the choice a bit harder but the 4th guy's window is definitely superior.

Tadcrazio
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#3 Post by Tadcrazio » Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:06 am

Windows on Washington wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:46 am
Throw out number 2 and 3 in my opinion.

After that, the guy pitching the restorations is correct in that the mezzo is not nearly as good a window. If you like the guy in the 1st quote, that make the choice a bit harder but the 4th guy's window is definitely superior.
Thank you! So the last guy selling the restorations came in at almost 10G's for 12 windows, it just seemed steep. I don't know if you can tell anything about price here without sizes. However, the restorations guy also advised not to cap the windows. I'm not sure what is truly the best thing to do here in terms of capping the windows.

edit just for context, the 1st guy was $4000.

masterext
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#4 Post by masterext » Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:42 am

The mezzo isnt really a good window and any internet search will reinforce that claim.
Number 4, sunrise “restorations” is the best by FAR. Its an excellent window and will serve you well for many years.
His pricing is actually very reasonable for that window.

Tadcrazio
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#5 Post by Tadcrazio » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:17 am

masterext wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:42 am
The mezzo isnt really a good window and any internet search will reinforce that claim.
Number 4, sunrise “restorations” is the best by FAR. Its an excellent window and will serve you well for many years.
His pricing is actually very reasonable for that window.
Thanks I appreciate that. I didn't see too much negativity in the way of mezzo especially in regards to argon leakage and sash sloping and flaking fading but i suppose i wasn't looking too hard.

I'm still concerned on capping, is it the best thing to do or not?

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Windows on Washington
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#6 Post by Windows on Washington » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:19 am

Capping, when done properly, is as proven as the idea of a replacement window. I didn't state it explicitly, but it is part of the reason that #2 should be thrown out of the consideration.

Tadcrazio
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#7 Post by Tadcrazio » Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:23 am

Windows on Washington wrote:
Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:19 am
Capping, when done properly, is as proven as the idea of a replacement window. I didn't state it explicitly, but it is part of the reason that #2 should be thrown out of the consideration.
Number 4 also doesn't cap :shock:

I suppose i should get more quotes from people. I'm looking to find window installers that sell similar to SunRise Restorations. Are there any other windows along the same line of windows that i can find an installer in my area for?

Tadcrazio
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#8 Post by Tadcrazio » Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:58 pm

Just got another quote from a company that sells higher end windows, they sell anderson and others and i told him what i was looking for in a window and he proposed the GreatLakes ComfortSmart Windows Double Hung windows. Total for all windows was $8000.

It looks like these are plygem? i thought Plygem was cheap windows..

Can anyone comment in terms of quality of these windows?


They also said they would replace the windows from the inside of the home and not cap unless it's needed to keep the look of the home.

WindowsDirectCinci
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#9 Post by WindowsDirectCinci » Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:38 pm

Number for does not need to cap Since he is quoting the built on brick mold it is a much different type of installation and will look amazing when finished. There is absolutely nothing wrong with capping the windows and has pretty much industry standard. The one guy maybe doesnt have a brake to do it? 😂 Also from experience in selling both Mezzo and the restorations windows the likelihood of you getting so failure in the restorations is nil and the mezzo would be about 50% over 6-7 years. Also in my opinion if you’re just having a noise issue on one room or window then I would think the $150 would be a no brainer for noise reduction glass

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toddinmn
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#10 Post by toddinmn » Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:04 am

Zero failures vs 50%, gotta call bs on that.

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HomeSealed
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#11 Post by HomeSealed » Sat Apr 04, 2020 3:27 pm

12 mezzo windows for $4k is playing russian roulette with a bullet in every chamber. Suspect product, and a guy installing it making no money at all. Literally. I have no idea how he's not actually paying you to do this at that price. He may seem nice, but this fits the exact profile of most BBB complaints about this industry. You are more than a -tad-crazio to go with that option.

The Restorations price is very reasonable, in fact I'd say pretty cheap if it includes the full-frame install with brickmold etc which is more comprehensive than a standard pocket. There is nothing wrong with doing that instead of capping, just a different method. Which is "better" depends on your specific installation needs, but again, it IS more involved.

The last option of Great Lakes may be worth consideration. Yes, plygem is generally known for builder grade windows, and the Great Lakes products aren't held in the high regard that they once were prior to Plygem takeover. Their higher end lines are still decent though (best that Plygem offers IMO), but believe the EcoSmart is their better line, not the Comfortsmart. That would be the closest thing to the Restorations, although I'd still say that the Restorations is preferred. In fact, given that the Comfortsmart appears to be the step down in the GL line, AND you amy be looking at pocket vs full frame installation here, the Restorations is likely the superior value.
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masterext
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#12 Post by masterext » Sat Apr 04, 2020 3:47 pm

Windowsdirectcinci is 100% correct. Number 4 with restorations is quoting with brickmould which would eliminate the need for capping. Thats a nice option.
The sunrise restorations is far superior to the other products you have seen. Quite frankly, the mezzo has no business even being mentioned in the same sentence as restorations.

WindowsDirectCinci
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#13 Post by WindowsDirectCinci » Sat Apr 04, 2020 6:13 pm

toddinmn wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:04 am
Zero failures vs 50%, gotta call bs on that.
I’ve probably sold 15-20,000 mezzos. Over a period of 7-8 years yes I’d stand behind my statement that that you’ll have seal failure in a very high rate. Maybe not 50% of customer will get one but a lot. I’m not saying 50% of windows will get seal failure. I’ve replaced mezzo seal failure just after a few months of the job being in. In 5-6 years of Sunrise I have yet to replace 1 single pane of glass for seal failure.

Tadcrazio
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#14 Post by Tadcrazio » Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:50 pm

HomeSealed wrote:
Sat Apr 04, 2020 3:27 pm
12 mezzo windows for $4k is playing russian roulette with a bullet in every chamber. Suspect product, and a guy installing it making no money at all. Literally. I have no idea how he's not actually paying you to do this at that price. He may seem nice, but this fits the exact profile of most BBB complaints about this industry. You are more than a -tad-crazio to go with that option.

The Restorations price is very reasonable, in fact I'd say pretty cheap if it includes the full-frame install with brickmold etc which is more comprehensive than a standard pocket. There is nothing wrong with doing that instead of capping, just a different method. Which is "better" depends on your specific installation needs, but again, it IS more involved.

The last option of Great Lakes may be worth consideration. Yes, plygem is generally known for builder grade windows, and the Great Lakes products aren't held in the high regard that they once were prior to Plygem takeover. Their higher end lines are still decent though (best that Plygem offers IMO), but believe the EcoSmart is their better line, not the Comfortsmart. That would be the closest thing to the Restorations, although I'd still say that the Restorations is preferred. In fact, given that the Comfortsmart appears to be the step down in the GL line, AND you amy be looking at pocket vs full frame installation here, the Restorations is likely the superior value.

Good stuff for sure! I think I've been convinced to stay away from Alside Mezzos at this point.

I wish I knew more about the great lakes and the argon leak %. Reviewing the quote for the great lakes product Doesn't have the model number for the comfortsmsrt but has the options. I noticed NFRC site had yen different pages for both comfort smart and ecosmart.

The options for the great lakes on the proposal are:
Spacers: EnergyTek (non-MetalSpacer)
Dual Glazed Glass Packages: Triple
Silver SmartGuard (Low E3 / Argon)
Included: Half Screen with Fiberglass
Mesh, SmartCore in Frame and Sash
with RigidCore Reinf, EZLock (Combo
Lok - Standard Color), Sound Control
Glass, Lifetime Accidental Glass
Breakage Warranty.

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HomeSealed
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Re: Replacing windows - Now lost

#15 Post by HomeSealed » Sun Apr 05, 2020 5:02 pm

Argon gas loss rate is a non-issue as long as you are talking about reputable manufacturers and assuming that the seal has not failed.
Take a closer look at the air infiltration and DP rating. That will tell you good bit as well.
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