Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

Ask replacement window questions & get answers!
Message
Author
Runabout
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:20 pm

Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#1 Post by Runabout »

Appreciate the thoughts of window install pros and consumers who have something to add!

Located in Dayton, OH – house is 80 years old, concrete block house, plaster walls and original steel frame single pane windows. Assuming I will live here for next 20 years or longer.

Was hoping to find a good window at the $500 installed price point.

Comparing window pricing using the price of one white vinyl, dual pane double hung with the “typical” specs – no upgrades. Majority of windows are one size, so using that as reference for my price comparison. Have 16 total double hungs. Using reputable installers only, so installer quality is not a variable.

I care about VT – I am the person pushing the curtains an extra inch back and noticing how much more light that gives, but I don’t want make a noticeable increase in cost of heat/ac bills to get a tad more light. Obviously I also want good numbers in the other areas, but VT is important.

Like the idea of thinner frames to improve view (I am the person that will notice this sort of thing) and light coming in (also not getting any grids).

Ruled out Vinylmax Edison due to poor remarks on a wide variety of forums – build quality and support install stuff.

Soft-lite Barringtons came in at $515 but I understand it is not a great window, not horrible but not great.

Only found one OKNA dealer here and they are waaaaaay too rich for my blood.

Provia Endures coming in at $625 - $660 from 2 different installers both quality. Little rich but seems like a much higher quality product. Is the step down from the Endure worth considering to reduce my cost?

Looking for quotes on Polaris Themaweld Plus and Ultraweld but am confused as to which would be best for me, assuming I can get a price in the sub 650, ideally closer to $500 range.

Heard mixed things about Sunrise… should I consider them? One local dealer that does Sunrise and Soft-lite said the least expensive I could get with them was about 1k per window... lmao. nope.

Also…. SCREENS – apparently half screens are the way to go?

I desperately don’t want bugs, I am very close to woods on a few sides of the house and bugs are plentiful. Want them outside so worried about half screen pushed up for lowering the top sash at night.

Also on the topic of screens… quality of screen frames?

Placement of screen frames/visual look? Any that botch the aesthetic?

Do all double hungs tilt in ok with the screen there or do some windows handle this poorly?

Screen material – recommendations? How pricey is upgrades for screens. I didn’t want to come to Ohio but had to due to family stuff, so feeling stuck here (things can change I know, but assuming I am stuck here, I want the best view through the windows as possible without breaking the bank.

Sound help. Busy road in front of house. Local window guy said no need to go beyond dual pane for climate, but I forgot to ask him and not sure if it would help noticeably for sound to go triple pane on front side of house or if some other upgrade would impact this.

I have heard of the SCT rating but not found it listed for windows.

I am no longer working due to family stuff and this will be a gasp of an expense but feels necessary so I can age in place and not be climbing ladders to put plastic on the outsides and blow dry it. Closing in on Medicare age. Inside plastic rarely sticks all winter, so outside is a must and holds up better… I use 3M No Residue duct tape (extreme strength and weatherability) – in case anyone stumbles on this and needs a good tape to keep plastic on the outside of the windows all winter long. $9 a roll but works beautifully. Hoping this is my last fall of having to do ladder shenanigans.!

Many many thanks. It is greatly appreciated. So many variables in the replacement window world!!

uncle eddie
Posts: 150
Joined: Tue Sep 18, 2012 7:52 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#2 Post by uncle eddie »

I had to look at the date on your post, I thought it must be at least 10 years old with that pricing talk.

Is it possible that you may find a great window and great installation from a great company that will be in business in the future to serve you? I suppose so, but its also possible that a macaroni penguin will crash through my window as I type this and do the cha-cha slide. The chances are about the same. The prices you call "high" are in reality still on the low end of the spectrum these days.

Advice: Double your budget (you can probably find something a little bit less) or wait until your personal circumstances improve.

Ricknez
Posts: 61
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2013 9:18 am
Location: southern PA, north east MD

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#3 Post by Ricknez »

There is absolutely no way you will find a quality window for anywhere near $500 per window. That is terribly unrealistic and you are setting yourself up for grave disappointment. The kicker is you have old metal windows with plaster, have fun with that.

User avatar
toddinmn
Posts: 912
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 9:02 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#4 Post by toddinmn »

I’d get pricing on the Thermalweld Plus since it is cheaper then the UltraWeld and a solid window. I’d focus on the window first since every company has different glass packages available. Triple pane is not going to much or anything to reduce sound and most sound reduction packages are going to price you out of your comfort zone. Your probably going to get hammered here with your budget but in all honesty even the Barrington is much better than what most people have in their houses.

User avatar
TheWindowNerd
Posts: 2011
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 3:05 pm
Location: SE PA & NJ; DFW/Metroplex

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#5 Post by TheWindowNerd »

Good day,
In my region I feel we are the best value, not the cheapest nor the most expensive.

Our normal price for a very good performer, 500DX or Potomac wh/wh no grids half screen, standard install would be $800 per window supplied and installed. That does not include the extra cost for steel removal, or RRP.
I share this with you so you can see you are low on the budget side as the fellow contributors have shared.

You might get into the $700, but any less and you are sacrificing something.

But a budget is a budget. May you have good fortune with your project.

theWindowNerd

Runabout
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:20 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#6 Post by Runabout »

Thanks everyone for the input.

Do you think the Provia Endure is a poor window?

Compared to the Barrington, is it worth $115 more per window?

I'd love to be able to do better windows and have hope that I will be able to climb out of poverty or win the lottery, but I have to act according to current circumstances and I could be 65 before I can return to work... prospects not great... lol...

so I have read in several places that the Endure was the top of the middle tier or the bottom of the higher tier... do you all feel otherwise? I know the Barrington is not great but I have the impression that it surpasses the big box stuff...

Many thanks to all of you!

Delaware Mike
Posts: 825
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 10:44 am
Location: South Jersey, Delaware, Philadelphia area

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#7 Post by Delaware Mike »

The ProVia Endure is decent. I'd rate it hire than a Barrington. I've installed Barrington's in the past and that line is okay. We do a decent amount of Endures when for whatever reason I'm not putting folks into my main OKNA series. ProVia has some new construction options what OKNA doesn't offer. I think the OKNA frame extrusions have more detail and I prefer the weatherstripping that OKNA utilizes. ProVia has the cool DuoTech locks, fiberglass sash reinforcement, and tons of options. I think it's worth that amount over the Barrington. Right now the QC with every manufacturer is shaky, so I've found that us poor dealers are reordering things more than ever.

Runabout
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:20 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#8 Post by Runabout »

Delaware Mike - thank you. Glad to hear the Provia has some things going for it. OKNAS around here are way out of my price range. Wish that wasn't the case lol.

Both the installers who quoted the Provia have excellent reps and are family owned/operated. One has already seen my steel, concrete plaster deal and said they get about 4 houses a year like mine and they are no picnic but there is no surcharge for the drama. He was an installer for over 20 years before he moved into sales, so he knows his stuff. That is a relief over a well meaning salesperson with no install experience.

Trying to source a Polaris Thermalweld Plus contractor with a great reputation as I have heard those windows are solid too. Wish I could see the 3 side by side to be able to get a feel for how they really look... seeing windows one at a time is tough. I think the rep coming this week will have the Endure and the Barrington although it seems like I will probably go with Provia and get fewer windows done. The company that has already been here said their install price was same regardless of one window or several, so at least I know I can get a window here and there as I track down cash.

I have been worried about pandemic fallout. I am being told it would likely be Feb if I order by end of September.

Many thanks for the input.

User avatar
HomeSealed
Posts: 2655
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:46 pm
Location: Milwaukee, Madison, Northern IL

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#9 Post by HomeSealed »

+1 to the feedback above. The windows that you are considering aren't awful. They aren't world beaters, but that's okay, sometimes the "above average" category can work, particularly with a restrictive budget.

With that said, the product is the least of your concerns imo. Those rates just aren't sustainable for a company of any size these days. As you can find shared earlier in this thread, even smaller contractors with little overhead would be hundreds more, $800-ish per window, perhaps dipping into the $700's. Most companies with a physical location and an "operation" are $1000+ these days with the highest priced companies well over $2k.

Many guys can make themselves sound good and qualified, and a crazy low price like that will make you REALLY want to believe them, but that is a major red flag, probably the biggest one there is. Realistically you will probably get the "taillight warranty" at a price like that, and despite what many people think, there can be a lot of problems with windows after the installation, particularly if they are done poorly.

You seem to be putting a lot of thought into this decision, I'd strongly recommend adding more weight to the installation company choice.

masterext
Posts: 1325
Joined: Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:14 am
Location: Window Pro-Serves All of Northern New Jersey. Bergen, Morris, Union, Essex, Passaic, Sussex Counties

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#10 Post by masterext »

Homesealed should get the quote of the year award. So true !

“Many guys can make themselves sound good and qualified, and a crazy low price like that will make you REALLY want to believe them, but that is a major red flag, probably the biggest one there is.”

User avatar
Windows on Washington
Posts: 4774
Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 11:23 am
Location: DC Metropolitan Area-Maryland/Virginia/DC

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#11 Post by Windows on Washington »

Agreed. Well stated.

Runabout
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:20 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#12 Post by Runabout »

I tried to post a reply earlier but apparently it is lost in cyberspace.

Really appreciate all the advice and the input about installer quality. That was the first thing I did, hunt down installers with longevity and solid reputations. I got quotes from Zen for comparison sake, but since they use "dedicated subcontractors" that I couldn't vet properly and didn't want to deal with fingerpointing games should something go south, passed on.

The nice thing about small cities like Dayton (other than the cost of living being super cheap here) is that there is depth here - generations of folks living in the same place... lots of grown folks living in their grandparents homes and prepared to leave the house to a grandkid of theirs. Other folks not leaving their small town in the ring around Dayton, and most of the rest of them not leaving the area but maybe moving to another small burg nearby. Getting intel on a business is easy. Either they, a relative or a friend has most likely dealt with the business. I loved living in SF, but for stuff like this, small city living has its benefits. So I am solid as it comes on installer options for Provia Endures - which is now my 2nd choice window.

Looking for same level of installer for the Polaris Thermalweld Plus which is now my preferred window -- after tracking down and playing around with full sized display windows for both Provia and Polaris, the Thermalweld wins. I know the guy that has run the local home and garden show for years, so hoping he has some good intel for me... small city living!

The Thermalweld was a prettier window in my opinion and it was nicer to operate. Felt better. buttery smooth. I actually stumbled on the Endure demo window by accident. On the way to the Polaris showroom I saw a Marvin showroom, so after I left the Polaris showroom I stopped in - figuring I might as well lay eyes and hands on Marvins since I was driving right by.

Had NO idea Marvin showroom would have Provia windows in their showroom. It was not obvious the Aspect and Endure were Provia windows. I was messing with them I was under-wowed with look or operation. In fact, I thought they were probably a low tier Marvin window. I was pretty shocked when I walked away and looked back and saw the big Endure sign on the top of the window display. In disbelief I went back and looked at the back side of the window nd there was the Provia label. The Endure wouldn't lock easily or properly. I pulled the top window down and pushed it back up and still it was not great. Hard time trying to get it to tilt. The Aspect was easier and more pleasant to operate but not an attractive window to me. I was stunned... and honestly the window was not so pretty having seen the Thermalweld. Those balance covers are ugly looking... looks like something was messed up and patched... 10 years from now I would be looking at those balance covers and kicking myself for not getting something that was decent window and still looked nice...I know balance covers are better than gapping holes for that style of window -but still they are ugly...

so crossing fingers I can find a Thermalweld Plus installer with a long history and great rep and competitive prices to the Endures.

2 different quality long term companies quoted the Endures installed within a few dollars of each other (low 600's for 33 x 56 double hung basic white on white) so I think the prices are solid and not subject to fly by night or shady.

From what I have seen (on other posts on this and other forums) Dayton and Ohio is a very affordable place to purchase windows. There are definitely pricier places that are selling 1K plus windows but folks in my zipcode aren't buying those... I do also like that both window companies are headquartered here in Ohio, like to support my local economies!!!

Thanks all for all your input and expertise. It is deeply appreciated.

I will post what I find for others who are wandering around the wilderness of replacement windows!

Delaware Mike
Posts: 825
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 10:44 am
Location: South Jersey, Delaware, Philadelphia area

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#13 Post by Delaware Mike »

I'm not a fan of that particular series of extrusions from ProVia's extruder. It comes from a huge family of similar styles and I'll never understand how they put those dated vinyl snap in sash stops in the jambs like a 1980's window when other's have omitted them? The top sash stops are often hidden behind the window blinds or treatments thought. When I mention these things to sales reps from the manufacturers, you will hear the worst moment of silence in human history as I never get the chance to be in the presence of the powers to be.

User avatar
toddinmn
Posts: 912
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 9:02 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#14 Post by toddinmn »

I’d just run it with out there balance covers. Location can have a huge difference in pricing . We just had 2 huge trees (over a 100’ and 67” diameter) taken down 2 hours west at our family farm. They charged us $600 and we gave them $1000. It was 3 guys all day, boom truck, skid steer. I have friend in that town that is a master electrician , he makes $25 per hour!

Runabout
Posts: 17
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:20 pm

Re: Vinyl Double Hungs in Ohio for $500 ish??? Screen options? VT and glass surface area... mind numb!

#15 Post by Runabout »

Delaware Mike - It is amazing they leave that but I guess you are right, so many people have window treatments that keep them covered up. I am a wide open type and since I don't have close neighbors to peep through the windows and the traffic is going way too fast I keep mine open as wide as possible expect for deep winter and hot hot days.

You reminded me when I worked for a company that had us going out to customers telling them we had cutting edge technology to support them and yet, we as sales team did not have laptops to show them our stuff. Laptops were not in the hands of kids back then but all the better companies had them. One person just looked at us and said "you don't have a laptop to show me products or do anything else at our meetings, that is not cutting edge." Not much we could do but tap dance...lol... I feel for those folks on the front lines of poor upper management.

Toddinmn - I keep my windows too open, looking at that gapping hole in the top would also chap my behind... especially when the Thermaweld looks nice and operates like butter and gets really good numbers for energy. Just need to find a nice price. When I moved back here from SF it was an adjustment to the low pricing structure and how many people who should have had solid middle class livings that were scraping by because they undercharged and did not mark up stuff... just passed it through... this pump cost me $134 so I will charge you $134. No accounting for administrative expenses, overhead, nothing. My parents plumber was so poor his van frequently had mechanical problems. Several times we had to help him get it started up... he did not charge me for snaking a drain across my driveway - he and his grown son were there for 2 hours. He didn't charge me because he did not get it open... the drain pipe was crushed. I had to call his daughter and give her my credit card and tell her what happened, she was smart enough to take the payment...lol... folks grind themselves down sometimes... I need to shop in the space of you are making enough to have a solid middle class life but I cannot afford to pay for private school for your kid or your Porsche. lol.

I think lots of folks who have always lived in bigger cities and more expensive locales cannot fathom that lower prices can be real.

Thanks again all!

Post Reply