Windows replacement - Recommendations please

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novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#1 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

Good Day to all,

After spending some time and getting quotes from multiple companies; I have narrowed down my final list to the below options. To give everyone an idea about my project I am giving the measurements below.

Windows rough opening measurements.
2nd floor 1 Twin unit 71.25 x 59.5 Full frame replacement
2 single unit 35.25 x 59.5 Pocket installation
1 st floor 1 twin unit 71.25 x 63.5 Pocket installation

Option 1 : Provia - Aspect
Vinyl + foam insulation + fiberglass re-inforced
Lead time 6-8 weeks
Glass Type: 3/4 "" COMFOR TECH Energy star rated DLA-UV (u-factor:0.25, SHGC: 0.27, Air infiltration <= 0.3)
INNERGY Thermal Reinforcement
Roll formed Aluminium screen frame
Super spacer instead of metal
free transferable manufacturer warranty
5 years for labor warranty (service calls will be free) after 5 years service call charges apply
Price: 6207 for 6 windows at 1034.5 per window.
Installer: Provia certified, A+ on BBB and in business for 45+ years

Option 2 : Sunrise- Vanguard line
Vinyl + foam insulation + fiberglass re-inforced
Lead time 14-16 weeks
Labor warranty included i.e. no fee for service calls for lifetime
Glass - S2210A (omega 12 with Thermal-U Plus) with SOLARCLEAN (u-factor 0.24, shgc 0.21, 7/8"" dual pane, 0.49 VT)
Manufacturers warranty transfers to second owner for $50 fee
air infiltration - .02 cfm
R Factor - 7.14 per linear inch
Optiview screens
$50 transfer fee for manufacturer and labor warranty
Price: 8028.1 for 6 windows at 1338.01 per window.
Installer: Sunrise authorized dealer, A+ on BBB and in business for 7 years

Option 3 : Simonton 5500 Reflections
Vinyl Standard
Lead time 12-14 weeks
Has5.0 reviews in google and A+ in BBB but only 6 years old company
labor warranty included
Prosolar E glass, 3/4"" thick, U factor 0.29, SHGC 0.25, VT 0.45
Extruded aluminium screen frame
free transferable manufacturer and labor warranty
Price:6826 for 6 windows at 1137.66 per window.
Installer: A+ on BBB and in business for 7 years


Can I please get your all's informed recommendations for the 3 options above. Personally I am kind of torn between Option 1 and 2. The lead time for Provia, installer's experience and cost are a plus for Option 1.
For Option 2 I am seeing the brand(line), the warranty as the plus. Not sure how much I can negotiate on the price though. Also the lead time is kind of a minus.

I am however not sure how Provia Aspect and Sunrise Vanguard compare.

Thanks in advance for your all's time.

Delaware Mike
Posts: 861
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 10:44 am
Location: South Jersey, Delaware, Philadelphia area

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#2 Post by Delaware Mike »

The Sunrise is better than the Aspect. I'm a direct certified dealer for both and still install both of those series. Those u-factors are off a bit too, maybe center of glass and not overall? On a standard Sunrise product (white or tan), Sunrise's lead times are pretty fast now. 3-4 weeks depending on tempering of any glass. The red flag (ProVia) would be the dealer's lead time from signed contract until installation. I don't know of a signal dealer in my entire area that is less than 16-weeks out due to the high volume of orders. There is an unprecedented shortage of installers in our industry if someone was able to come out in 6-weeks that would kind of scare me.

Sunrise has some of the best glass and spacer tech in the industry with Cardinal. Even though it's still metal (stainless steel) it's still regarded as the gold standard. The one knock on Sunrise is their pricing which is always high compared to other vinyl which is the main reason it's not my more common "go to" window.

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Windows on Washington
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Joined: Fri Oct 27, 2006 11:23 am
Location: DC Metropolitan Area-Maryland/Virginia/DC

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#3 Post by Windows on Washington »

Another vote for the Sunrise.

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HomeSealed
Posts: 2785
Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 3:46 pm
Location: Milwaukee, Madison, Northern IL

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#4 Post by HomeSealed »

I'd also vote for the Sunrise. That dealer sounds like he's trying to set you up for success with that lead time, perhaps he'll be able to install earlier and everyone is happy.

I'm not a huge fan of the Provia window and that lead time is concerning as DM mentioned. Either they are lying, or there is some other concerning reason why they wouldn't be back-logged at a time when every reputable company is.

Some of the stats aren't lining up either. You don't have the actual air infiltration rating on the Provia, that's just the generic NFRC reference that it passes their bare minimum requirement (which is awful). In addition, without looking up the details, the U values sound like glass with surface 4 low-e (interior surface that you can touch). If you are in a cold climate or have any concern about condensation, I'd avoid that.... If you are somewhere more moderate to warm it can be a nice option IMO.

Lastly, 10 years in business is the statistical threshold where companies failure rate drops dramatically, but 7 years isn't awful if they are well established in your area. Sunrise generally deals direct with financially stable companies (not so with Provia or Simonton which can be purchased by anyone with a pulse at a supply house), so that also helps improve your odds.

novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#5 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

Delaware Mike wrote: Thu Mar 10, 2022 7:18 am The Sunrise is better than the Aspect. I'm a direct certified dealer for both and still install both of those series. Those u-factors are off a bit too, maybe center of glass and not overall? On a standard Sunrise product (white or tan), Sunrise's lead times are pretty fast now. 3-4 weeks depending on tempering of any glass. The red flag (ProVia) would be the dealer's lead time from signed contract until installation. I don't know of a signal dealer in my entire area that is less than 16-weeks out due to the high volume of orders. There is an unprecedented shortage of installers in our industry if someone was able to come out in 6-weeks that would kind of scare me.

Sunrise has some of the best glass and spacer tech in the industry with Cardinal. Even though it's still metal (stainless steel) it's still regarded as the gold standard. The one knock on Sunrise is their pricing which is always high compared to other vinyl which is the main reason it's not my more common "go to" window.
Thanks Delaware Mike. The color that I am targeting is Tan. So hopefully I can work on the price for Sunrise. Only thing is the brochure that the dealer left with me does not say Vanguard but the quote says Vanguard.

novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#6 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

Windows on Washington wrote: Thu Mar 10, 2022 10:52 am Another vote for the Sunrise.
Thanks WoW.

novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#7 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

HomeSealed wrote: Thu Mar 10, 2022 12:28 pm I'd also vote for the Sunrise. That dealer sounds like he's trying to set you up for success with that lead time, perhaps he'll be able to install earlier and everyone is happy.

I'm not a huge fan of the Provia window and that lead time is concerning as DM mentioned. Either they are lying, or there is some other concerning reason why they wouldn't be back-logged at a time when every reputable company is.

Some of the stats aren't lining up either. You don't have the actual air infiltration rating on the Provia, that's just the generic NFRC reference that it passes their bare minimum requirement (which is awful). In addition, without looking up the details, the U values sound like glass with surface 4 low-e (interior surface that you can touch). If you are in a cold climate or have any concern about condensation, I'd avoid that.... If you are somewhere more moderate to warm it can be a nice option IMO.

Lastly, 10 years in business is the statistical threshold where companies failure rate drops dramatically, but 7 years isn't awful if they are well established in your area. Sunrise generally deals direct with financially stable companies (not so with Provia or Simonton which can be purchased by anyone with a pulse at a supply house), so that also helps improve your odds.
Thanks HomeSealed. The installer was referred by Sunrise when I filled out a consultation form on Sunrise's website. Hoping to work out the price.
For Provia; the way I took the stats were from their website based on the quote and explanation I got from the installer.

Delaware Mike
Posts: 861
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 10:44 am
Location: South Jersey, Delaware, Philadelphia area

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#8 Post by Delaware Mike »

I've not been selling and installing but a few uniquely optioned Sunrise Vanguard projects per year since I'm in OKNA's backyard feel that their product fits my marketplace and preferences. I use to get a really nice full size Vanguard brochure that had most of the information in it similar to the regular Sunrise brochure. The last time I requested a batch of new Vanguard brochures they sent me out a dummied down tri-fold thing that was barely an overview of the series. I feel that I need that hand that out along with a regular Sunrise brochure to do the Vanguard justice. I like the Vanguard DH over the base model due to the sash reinforcement, accidental lifetime glass and screen breakage warranty. The next level up is their Restorations which is even nicer.

The only thing that I like about the ProVia lines verses the Sunrise is the mortised sill dam on the ProVia. Sunrise deletes this for more visible glass which is fine and preferable if retaining maximum glass in a pocket insert is of more importance. One thing nice about Sunrise is their warranty. I've never not had them questioned anything that I've needed.

novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#9 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

Delaware Mike wrote: Thu Mar 10, 2022 10:10 pm I've not been selling and installing but a few uniquely optioned Sunrise Vanguard projects per year since I'm in OKNA's backyard feel that their product fits my marketplace and preferences. I use to get a really nice full size Vanguard brochure that had most of the information in it similar to the regular Sunrise brochure. The last time I requested a batch of new Vanguard brochures they sent me out a dummied down tri-fold thing that was barely an overview of the series. I feel that I need that hand that out along with a regular Sunrise brochure to do the Vanguard justice. I like the Vanguard DH over the base model due to the sash reinforcement, accidental lifetime glass and screen breakage warranty. The next level up is their Restorations which is even nicer.

The only thing that I like about the ProVia lines verses the Sunrise is the mortised sill dam on the ProVia. Sunrise deletes this for more visible glass which is fine and preferable if retaining maximum glass in a pocket insert is of more importance. One thing nice about Sunrise is their warranty. I've never not had them questioned anything that I've needed.
Thanks Delaware Mike. Would you happen to know if the dealer is of the type "manufacturer-direct" dealer; then they might be manufacturing with Sunrise and branding them as their own? All the brochure says is "Platinum Series". Please see the attached image.
platinumseries.png
Also is my price is high (about 1338) because of 2 large units. If I could bring it down to about 1000 per unit i.e. 6000 would it be a good deal?
Appreciate the insight about the warranty.

WindowsDirectCinci
Posts: 204
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2016 2:46 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#10 Post by WindowsDirectCinci »

The Platinum Series window is a private labeled Sunrise Vanguard window with a few options that come as standard. Feel free to reach out to me directly if you have any questions chris@windowsdirectusa.com

novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#11 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

WindowsDirectCinci wrote: Sat Mar 12, 2022 10:15 am The Platinum Series window is a private labeled Sunrise Vanguard window with a few options that come as standard. Feel free to reach out to me directly if you have any questions chris@windowsdirectusa.com
Thanks WindowsDirectCinci for the confirmation. I appreciate it very much.

novicehomeowner22
Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Mar 03, 2022 9:34 pm

Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#12 Post by novicehomeowner22 »

WindowsDirectCinci wrote: Sat Mar 12, 2022 10:15 am The Platinum Series window is a private labeled Sunrise Vanguard window with a few options that come as standard. Feel free to reach out to me directly if you have any questions chris@windowsdirectusa.com
Thank you very much Chris for successfully taking care of my needs.
  • The very first thing I would like to share my appreciation is the way you and your team made sure my project was taken care in a timely manner given that I requested it to be complete by a certain date
  • The second important feedback is the open communication that you and your team maintained from the time I singed the contract to the time the installation was done.
  • Finally a big shoutout to your installation team who made sure the installs were done in a timely manner and also made sure that the working area was cleaned and left without any mess.

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Windows on Washington
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Re: Windows replacement - Recommendations please

#13 Post by Windows on Washington »

Nice feedback.

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