Comfortworld Windows

[scott1q1]

Where to start...First off the numbers you are using are generally for two or more people, rarely will you see a solo installer its just not practical on a daily basis.

For the low budget companies that are not capping the exteriors a solo guy may be good, but thats uncommon.

2. Installers spend a good bit of time and money loading up, driving to your house, cleaning up and disposing of the old windows.

3. Which is it, installers average a window per hour or a decent installer can do 20 windows in a day?...they can do very well if you have the right kind of house and existing windows but that is easily balanced by the jobs on the other end of the spectrum.

4. A varient of 3, how much money do you think they make on the people who want less than five windows and are a bit of a drive from the office...again its somewhat of a take the good with the bad system.

5. The installer in this scenario is getting paid on a 1099, so he is on the hook for both his and the employers share of his taxes and other deductions.

6. Truck/trailer/tools. Without going in to details for this guy to be dependable, fast, and do a quality job in all circumstances he is going to need to spend many thousands of dollars here.

7. Insurance and other business expenses can eat up a good bit of cash depending on his employers requirements. Lets not even talk about the costs for this guy to have employees.

In my experience installers make around 10-15% of the total you pay for your job, and are 100% responsible for a whole lot of important parts of that same job.

If we want to whine about how much someone in the process of your getting new windows makes we can probably find better places to point fingers lol.

Sorry installer rant aside imo the only 2 differences between WW and alot of other companies is the installers will be hit and miss and they advertise a cheap price so much that they are less dependant on referals than other companies.

You can't honestly believe that people will work for half the money for no reason...especially as an installer, its a fairly taxing job.

[georgeorwell]

I get your explanation but my position remains that a WW installer gets $30 - $50 per window he doesnt have to pay anybody out of that. I have no Idea what bennies he gets beside that if any.
So why would a WW installer be better off working for a Sub and getting a piece of the total $50 - $100 per window? Most likely $10 - $15. I just can't see how the argument I see time and time again,
"if a WW installer was any good he would be working for another company"

Ok lets say he was good, how can he make more with another company based on your figures? How many other companies and installation jobs are there in a given location to make it worth wile to him to change companies?
I also dissigree with the position on the hardships and exposers to chemicals etc. Try Steel working which my father did for 40 years, or construction or many many other low paying factory jobs. The average construction worker lifts more gets hurt more, is exposed to more and is in more danger than a windows installer every day he works. He also usually has his own equipment to buy and truck. The same goes for an auto mechanic. None of those jobs can you make $100k per year or anywhere close.

I'm not knocking you or your argument but the people that Bash WW installers as incompetent. I'm sure there are enough incompetence going around for everyone. Having my own business I can attest that its very hard to get decent people to work anymore, having built my last house and was the contractor getting and keeping decent workers on the job is a job in itself. I hear and see the same argument everywhere I look. Its hard to get good people that will do a good days work weather you are WW or joe blow windows company. Turn over is a part of life anymore.

[windowmann2000]

George your totally out to lunch, most of Scott's points are dead on and the number of installers that make 100k a year are as rare as hens teeth. Some points Scott didn't mention are paying both halves of Social security, rain days no paid vacation...............pension, what pension it's his own savings from every job. Overtime.............what overtime. I could go on forever. The average window installer if he's good makes 60-70k and if their in a smaller market, less. Very few WW people make over 50k. Most of the time their skill level won't get them the better jobs and WW's position is to throw them under the bus if they don't like them or the work they do. I'm familiar with four franchises and at two of them the installers get $50 per opening wrapped the other two $10 and $15 more and the latter you won't buy a window for $189.00. My best crew can install and wrap 15 windows in a day on a ranch home and I pay them $70 per window. That's optimum and they make about $75k a year. Take away all the above and it's pretty much a slightly above average job. Their skill level took about 25 years to get where they are now.
I'll bet you'd lose it if I told you about a day in august I made almost $5000.00 in commissions. According to your calculations x five days in a week......four weeks in a month. Your obviously making comments about something you know nothing of. Get back to your window somebody wants to order some fries.

[scott1q1]

"I get your explanation but my position remains that a WW installer gets $30 - $50 per window he doesnt have to pay anybody out of that. I have no Idea what bennies he gets beside that if any.
So why would a WW installer be better off working for a Sub and getting a piece of the total $50 - $100 per window? Most likely $10 - $15."

I'm not sure you understand the ww guy is a sub, just like the other guy, he exactly is getting a piece of $30-$50/window, as opposed to a piece of $50-$100. Again sure he can work solo but will then get less than half as much done per day wherever he works.

The guys people in the business consider very good subs rarely hurt for work.

I'm surprised that you own your own business but can't see the difference between a steel worker/other construction worker and a window sub. Its hard but by paying a good hourly rate and treating people well I can hire a talented guy who will show up to the warehouse and work hard five days a week.

Hiring a sub with good customer service skills that people are comfortable having in their homes, will never miss a scheduled job, has the experience and cares enough to always make the finished job look great, and will always represent my company in the best manner possible is ten times harder.

Really hire whoever you want, I'm not bashing WW, just the perception that window installers are morons that can't distinguish a $20 bill from a $50 bill.

[Delaware Mike]

George,

No doubt that your Father worked in one of the hardest fields out there. I had a friend that passed away from bone cancer (in his face) just shy of age 40 and he was a pipe fitter/welder. I've personally worked for Duponts and the vinyl division of BF Goodrich. I was right out of school and was a laborer. Tyvek suits, rubber gloves, duct tape, and air masks were a every day standard for me. I've worked with some pigments that go into making black phone cords called Mogul L that one would have to scrub of one's eyelids for 10 minutes with Lava soap to try to remove.

I've also heard reports that carepenters can have some of the longest lifespans due to the amount of exercise that they get throught their work. All I'm saying is that I now carry a respirator and some light duty dust masks in my truck for those occasions when we run into lead paint falling off all over the place on windows that have not been touched for 50 years that need lots of work.

In all my years working for Duponts and BF Goodrich I've never went home as dirty and tired as installing windows working under a deadline. We always had set breaks, safety precausions, and the ability to shower at the plants so they we could get into our cars pretty cleaned up. I've spent hours and days coughing up stuff after some installs. How about some of the shrubs and rose bushes in front of homeowners windows? Middle of summer with pants on and insects tearing us up around the bushes and thorns trying to rip the flesh from our bones.

You show me an installer making more than $90K and I'll show you a hustler that bust his hump. If he has kids I'm sure they are looking at their father and thinking "I'm going to stay in school!"

[Windows on Washington]

I've also heard reports that carepenters can have some of the longest lifespans due to the amount of exercise that they get throught their work. All I'm saying is that I now carry a respirator and some light duty dust masks in my truck for those occasions when we run into lead paint falling off all over the place on windows that have not been touched for 50 years that need lots of work.

Mike,

No need to really wear a repsirator for lead based paint contaminations in what we do. The lead has to become airborne and unless you are hitting it with a DA sander, it will not become friable. I would highly recommend that you wear a repsirator when dealing with fiberglass. Fiberglass will pose a larger risk than asbestos will in the long run and people work with that stuff all the time take zero precautions.

We are in total agreement on the pay end of things. An installer making 90K is earning every penny of it and I fear that Georges numbers and impressions are fairly askew.

[thewindowdude]

Let me clear up some things about the Comfort World windows. Allside is a Vendor to contractors. The company (FACTORY) that makes the Allside windows is: Associated Materials Inc.

Window World Sells the Comfort World window which they have trade marked the name. Guess who the factory is that makes the windows for them??? You got it, Associated Materials Inc.

So, the Allside Excallibur window and the Window World 4000 series are not the same, but the same factory so, they are the same....got it?

So, the Allside Ultramax window and Window Worlds 6000 Series are not the same window, but the same factory so, they are the same...got it?

The difference is: Window World buys the windows from the factory, so does Allside. Window World sells the windows to people. Allside sells windows to Contractors who in turn, mark up and sell to people.

Ah, the price difference.

[alex11]

i was talking to a contractor and he says most good installers(subs) get paid 50-60 bucks a window. when that other guy said making 600 buckks a day is great money;he's right but there is one problem..the window guy is'nt making 600 bucks a day 5 days per week. he is not even working 5 days per week. that 600 bucks in one day may have to last him a whole week. get the picture!

[windowdude]

...and he may be getting "paid" 600 bucks a day, but he's not "making" 600 bucks a day. So after he pays everything he has to pay, he may be left with 200 bucks to last him the week. It's a hard job.

[flyingfreddy]

So it's been 4 years now... and I gotta ask.

George Degard: How are the windows standing up for you?



I know you get what you pay for, I came across this thread because with 21 windows I can't afford to go big and I am looking for some more "economical" solutions. I've read so many threads on this forum my head is starting to spin.

[onesojourner]

I would like to know how these windows are doing after 5 years or so. I have not been able to find any one really complaining about problems with them.

[sluis2008]

I know more about window world than probably anyone on here. I used to work for them as a contractor. Yes i said contractor. They do not employ any installers. They are all sub contractors. Some are great, others are horrible. But that is besides the point. Also window world or world of windows, is a franchise. So your exp. is with a small or large buyer of that name. Now as far as the 4000 and 6000 series windows are concerned, YES they are an alside product. The are manufactured by AMI, who make the Alside window. And window worlds window is just a private label window with them.

so i hope this helps, let me know if i can offer anymore inside info.