vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

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PeteCLE
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vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#1 Post by PeteCLE »

Hi - Seeking advice on quotes for vinyl replacement windows in the Cleveland area. I have received the following quotes for 18 double hung windows. Double-pane. 9 with grids. White interior and exterior. The old windows are vinyl single hung. House has vinyl siding, if that matters.

1. Okna Eco-Pro 600 $11,200 ($8,500 for windows + 2,700 for install; this is the only quote that gave a breakout)
2. Sunrise Standard $11,000. My understanding is that this is the middle tier window for Sunrise.
3. Sunrise Essentials $9,300. Same installer as the Sunrise Standard.
4. Interstate 6800 - $8,700

The company that quoted the Sunrise windows also offers SoftLite. Should I get a quote on that brand?
Any other brands I should consider?
Thanks for your help!

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Windows on Washington
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#2 Post by Windows on Washington »

Not sure you need to re-quote the Sunrise quote. The EcoPro is the slightly better option if you are looking at performance data.

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HomeSealed
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#3 Post by HomeSealed »

+1. The Sunrise standard at that price is a nice option, however the Okna 600 is better and a very good deal at that price if this is a reputable company.

If the guy is able to quote the Softlite LS or Elements and its around that same price point then you can take your pick, but on this list the Okna 600 is a clear winner and a very good price even though its somehow your highest....

You must have a plethora of qualified window installers over in Cleveland. There are areas where the raw cost of install exceeds what you were quoted as a retail price.

PeteCLE
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#4 Post by PeteCLE »

Thanks very much for the responses. I went back to the company that gave the Sunrise quote and asked for a SoftLite LS or Elements quote. His response was that he'll give me Sunrise Restorations for the same $11,000 price as the Sunrise Standard, and that would be a better value than what he could give on SoftLite. He is pitching the Restorations as the best vinyl replacement window across all brands. He did say that he needs an answer this week, which is a tactic I'm not crazy about. But the company does seem to have very good reviews. Any thoughts on Sunrise Restorations? Thanks!

masterext
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#5 Post by masterext »

He said he needs to know this week? maybe he does for whatever reason, i wouldnt put too much emphasis on that.
Restorations is a very good window, you will be very happy with it.

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HomeSealed
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#6 Post by HomeSealed »

The Restorations is a more compelling comparison, but the Okna 600 is still better imo. More stoutly built, superior u value and air leakage ratings with apples to apples options. Based on product alone, both will serve you will, but again, advantage 600.

With that said, they are close enough that if you feel much more comfortable with the Sunrise dealer and the quality and service that they offer, that could be the proper choice in that case. Both windows will serve you well in the end.

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Windows on Washington
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#7 Post by Windows on Washington »

+1. Both are solid choices. I still like the 600 for the strength aspect in that comparison though.

PeteCLE
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#8 Post by PeteCLE »

Thanks again for your input on the window choices. Hopefully you can also help with an installation question. My current windows are framed very plainly on the interior: drywall on the top and sides with a simple wooden window sill at the bottom. The back edge of the sill sits up against the inside edge of the window frame, as shown in the attached picture. The drywall also runs up against the inside edge of the window frame. The new windows will be thicker, so they will extend farther in. Both the Okna and Sunrise installers said the new windows would sit on top of the sill and will fit inside the existing drywall. Is that the typical way to do it? I was expecting the windows to be attached directly to the house frame. The sills are very plain, so I might want to replace them someday, which would be a problem if the window is on top of the sill. Thanks for your help!
Attachments
interior.jpg

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Windows on Washington
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#9 Post by Windows on Washington »

That is normally how it is done. As an option, you could request that the cut the stool back? Its a PITB, but an option.

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HomeSealed
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#10 Post by HomeSealed »

+1, that's the most common install type by far for this circumstance. As WoW explained, the other option would be to cut back the stool and the drywall to accommodate the deeper frame to be installed at the original size. This is pretty messy and tedious, so expect a decent upcharge if they are even willing to do it.

Secondly, if you are planning to change the stools or overall finishing of the window openings, NOW is the time to do it, at the time of new window installation. One thing that we've done with nice results is installed trim kits (pre built and finished jamb boxes and casing) right over the sheet rock return (it could be removed as well if you want). This adds a nice clean jamb as well as casing, dressing up the opening quite a bit if you like that look.

PeteCLE
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#11 Post by PeteCLE »

Hi HomeSealed - On a thread about windows in Michigan you had this comment:
"Sunrise does not achieve Energy Star for the Northern Zone (in double hung) with a standard single surface low e coating on double pane glass. They resort to glass coatings that are not ideal for your climate. You would be best served going to triple pane, or in this case actually better served getting the single coat low e and not technically meeting Energy Star."
I have been considering Sunrise Restorations with Omega-12 glass, which is described as 12 layers of coatings. Is this what you recommend against? What is the downside to the coatings?
Does the fact that Sunrise needs all the coatings to achieve Energy Star mean there is some other deficiency in their window construction?
The glass package on the Okna 600 quote is called HeatSeal and the brochure shows 11 layers of coatings. Does that have the same downside as the Sunrise coatings?
Thanks for all your help!

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Windows on Washington
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#12 Post by Windows on Washington »

I think HomeSealed is referring to a Surface 4 Low-e when he talked about "additional coatings". If so, Okna does not use a Surface 4 application.

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HomeSealed
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Re: vinyl replacement windows in Cleveland

#13 Post by HomeSealed »

PeteCLE wrote: Thu Sep 03, 2020 8:59 pm Hi HomeSealed - On a thread about windows in Michigan you had this comment:
"Sunrise does not achieve Energy Star for the Northern Zone (in double hung) with a standard single surface low e coating on double pane glass. They resort to glass coatings that are not ideal for your climate. You would be best served going to triple pane, or in this case actually better served getting the single coat low e and not technically meeting Energy Star."
I have been considering Sunrise Restorations with Omega-12 glass, which is described as 12 layers of coatings. Is this what you recommend against? What is the downside to the coatings?
Does the fact that Sunrise needs all the coatings to achieve Energy Star mean there is some other deficiency in their window construction?
The glass package on the Okna 600 quote is called HeatSeal and the brochure shows 11 layers of coatings. Does that have the same downside as the Sunrise coatings?
Thanks for all your help!
Forget about how many layers the manufacturer touts and look at the performance ratings. For your location, I'd recommend Ultra U Plus over Omega 12. Its .01 worse in U value, but has a better VT, more appropriate SHGC for your climate, and the same CR. Omega 12 is more useful in sunny, hot climates with its low solar gain.

One thing that I do want to stress though, and as WoW alluded to, is to avoid the "squared" version of each of those glass packages. They achieve an impressive U value by adding a hard coat layer of low e to the interior surface of the glass. This effectively isolates the glass to the exterior (the low e reflects the heat before warming the glass) and decimates the CR (condensation resistance). Much like the Omega 12 glass this technology is great in the right application, but a cold climate that can see window condensation in the winter is not it.

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